tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post9171959708258479026..comments2023-10-01T16:53:17.274+01:00Comments on Cicero's Songs: The Liberal Democrat LeaderCicerohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02090838836212624633noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-74641232092429846782008-05-06T13:17:00.000+01:002008-05-06T13:17:00.000+01:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-86950995169559387322007-11-30T19:17:00.000+00:002007-11-30T19:17:00.000+00:00The point is not so much that Chris is a statist, ...The point is not so much that Chris is a statist, having spoken to him privately at some length I don't believe he is - he is a localist first & foremost. Which is better than nothing but is not the ame as being an 'ideological liberal'<BR/><BR/>However, what really worries me is that Chris's campaign has pandered so blatantly to the statist tendencies which have so hampered our party. he has run an anti-chice , pro-status quo campaign that says the only reform needed to public services is to devolve them to local authorities.<BR/><BR/>That's not a liberal revolution that's social democratic managerialism.Bullseyehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18347146128494224647noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-16078133310848687432007-11-30T14:59:00.000+00:002007-11-30T14:59:00.000+00:00Polly Toynbee is admittedly wrong about virtually ...Polly Toynbee is admittedly wrong about virtually everything, but I reamin unshaken!Cicerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02090838836212624633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-38603759844030362552007-11-30T13:30:00.000+00:002007-11-30T13:30:00.000+00:00Hi Cicero - I've been having the same problems as ...Hi Cicero - I've been having the same problems as you separating the two. I actually think there are far better choices who for wahatever reasons decided not to stand, which is a shame.<BR/><BR/>I agree that Huhne has run the far better campaign and has shown better under fire. I have been thinking about him seriously.<BR/><BR/>However yesterday I received a communication from him that quoted Polly Toynbee backing him.<BR/><BR/>I am now much more inclined to Clegg on the clear principle that 'anything Polly Toynbee says the opposite is always the case.'Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-66546145767563122812007-11-30T12:15:00.000+00:002007-11-30T12:15:00.000+00:00I agree with bullseye on this. I've found Chris's ...I agree with bullseye on this. I've found Chris's anti-choice campaign very off putting.<BR/><BR/>He's been pandering to the part of the party I find it most difficult to get along with - the conservative 'radical' who rejects individual freedom in favour of political control (even if it is at a local level).<BR/><BR/>He's really put such a negative impression in my mind that I can't vote for him...Tristanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15395992764678278326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-17138873878579044702007-11-30T10:36:00.000+00:002007-11-30T10:36:00.000+00:00Either candidate would be a decent leader, what ti...Either candidate would be a decent leader, what tips it for me is the life experience factor. I do not buy Chris Huhne as a statist, and as you know Charles your views and mine co-incide pretty closely. I do not think Clegg is quite the finished article, and would prefer to keep him in reserve. Huhne is the guy, who on balance is the most ideological Liberal, and I think that this is importnant.Cicerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02090838836212624633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-67289170908133775802007-11-30T08:43:00.000+00:002007-11-30T08:43:00.000+00:00Having read your blog over reecent weeks I'm not s...Having read your blog over reecent weeks I'm not surprised by your eventual choice. I think however you are making a mistake even on your own terms to quote you<BR/><BR/>"Liberalism is a disciplined and coherent ideology based on maximising the freedom of the individual. We are economically Liberal because that is the best way to generate prosperity, we are socially Liberal because the role of the state should not define how individuals should live their lives."<BR/><BR/>That is an superb quote but it simply isn't refelcted in Chris campaign programme. Although Chris has run an excellent campaign - it has been squarely aimed at pandering to the statist, anti-choice agenda of the party's activist base, not at developing a wider appeal based on our core values.<BR/><BR/>If he wins he will have so narrowed our room for manouvre that we will be stuck with increasingly outdated public service policies which will be I suspect almost the antithesis of what you yourself advocate.<BR/><BR/>In short Chris is good, but he is worng.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-41177776436162256792007-11-30T00:06:00.000+00:002007-11-30T00:06:00.000+00:00"Nevertheless, for his experience, his principles ..."Nevertheless, for his experience, his principles and his disciplined focus"<BR/><BR/>Ming had all that even more than Chris, little it helped him.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-36387690365370939192007-11-29T18:24:00.000+00:002007-11-29T18:24:00.000+00:00I think we underestimate the importance of affabil...I think we underestimate the importance of affability at our peril. That is the one area in which the new leader really has to hit the ground running.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-53833518840872697222007-11-29T14:43:00.000+00:002007-11-29T14:43:00.000+00:00Cicero,A few weeks ago you got rather indignant ab...Cicero,<BR/><BR/>A few weeks ago you got rather indignant about the Tory proposal to have only English MPs vote on English matters. I remember some distinct harrumphing about such a plan endangering the Union. Last week Chris Huhne appeared to endorse the plan. How can you support him given his disregard for your beoved Union with Scotland? WheatleyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15037609.post-30836548129418753522007-11-29T13:28:00.000+00:002007-11-29T13:28:00.000+00:00I think the 'unfinished article' argument is only ...I think the 'unfinished article' argument is only meant to be a tie-breaker. I agree that if one candidate is clearly better than the other today, then vote for him. FWIW IMHO Nick is that candidate.Joe Ottenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18380362092159905533noreply@blogger.com